[Unistats] Fw: New student data elements for low SES - feedback

Wendy Marchment w.marchment at griffith.edu.au
Fri Sep 12 07:25:42 WST 2008


Dear all,

There's been some traffic on the edequity listserv about the new data 
elements for low SES which was announced in the latest HEIMS newsletter. 
The equity practitioners find it very strange and anomolous that they 
weren't included in the consultation. EOPHEA will be writing to DEEWR with 
their feedback on the proposal.

I have copied my email to the ed equity list as per below . Please note 
that Gavin meant 'the norm' when he said 'normal parents'.

It would be helpful if we could frame out responses (due on 19 Sept) along 
similar lines and have it go from a DVC/VC in our institutions to add some 
weight to a revision of the proposal. Please consult with relevant equity 
practitioners in your institution.


Regards

Wendy Marchment
Director
Quality, Planning and Statistics 
Nathan campus, Griffith University 
Nathan  QLD  4111  Australia
www.griffith.edu.au/qps
Email: W.Marchment at griffith.edu.au
Telephone  (07) 373 54027 
Facsimile    (07) 373 55525 
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----- Forwarded by Wendy Marchment/Staff/Griffith on 12/09/2008 09:14 AM 
-----

Wendy Marchment/Staff/Griffith 
11/09/2008 09:53 AM

To
<edequity-aus at utas.edu.au>
cc
Gavin Moodie/Staff/Griffith, Deborah.Tranter at unisa.edu.au
Subject
Fw: New student data elements for low SES - feedback





Dear all,

I have discussed and agree with Gavin's points below. He has given me 
permission to pass this on to the equity listserv.

My only additional comment is that ideally, this information should be 
collected through tertiary admission centres where possible and be part of 
the downloaded information to university student systems. This would allow 
for possible analysis on applicants and offers as well as enrolments.


Regards

Wendy Marchment
Director
Quality, Planning and Statistics 
Nathan campus, Griffith University 
Nathan  QLD  4111  Australia
www.griffith.edu.au/qps
Email: W.Marchment at griffith.edu.au
Telephone  (07) 373 54027 
Facsimile    (07) 373 55525 
************************************************************** 
PRIVATE AND CONFIDENTIAL 
This e-mail and any files transmitted with it are intended solely for the 
use of the addressee(s) and may contain information that is confidential 
or privileged. 
If you receive this e-mail and you are not the addressee, please disregard 
the contents of the e-mail, delete the e-mail, and notify the author 
immediately. 
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----- Forwarded by Wendy Marchment/Staff/Griffith on 11/09/2008 09:45 AM 
-----

Gavin Moodie <g.moodie at griffith.edu.au> 
11/09/2008 09:24 AM

To
W.Marchment at griffith.edu.au
cc
Cathy McGrath <s.spence at griffith.edu.au>, Heather Cameron 
<h.cameron at griffith.edu.au>, Joanna Peters <j.peters at griffith.edu.au>, 
John Fairbairn <j.fairbairn at griffith.edu.au>, Sue Spence 
<c.mcgrath at griffith.edu.au>, Suzanne Wilkinson 
<suzanne.wilkinson at griffith.edu.au>
Subject
New student data elements for low SES - feedback







Wendy 

The question is too complicated and confusing.  It should ask simply the 
highest qualification of any parent, or the highest qualification of 
mother and the highest qualification of father, and leave it to the very 
few students who do not have normal parents to adapt their response to 
their situation, as they have done for most of their life.  I note, 
incidentally, that answering the question seems to be voluntary so 
students can decline to answer if their circumstances don't fit or they 
find the question insensitive in imposing a norm. 

The classification of qualifications is far too crude.  In addition to the 
current levels it should collect data on parents who completed year 11, 
year 10, other secondary, primary education, no formal schooling and don't 
know. 

The significance of level of highest qualification is related to year of 
completion.  I expect completing year 11 would indicate mid-low ses in 
1985 but mid-high SES in 1955.  So this data element will have to be 
interpreted within time periods.  Nonetheless, I do not think date when 
parent completed their highest qualification should be collected because 
many students will not know this and it will add to their frustration with 
completing the form.  I suggest that date that parent completed their 
highest qualification be inferred from the student's age: this will be 
pretty rough, but hopefully good enough. 

While parents' highest qualification would be a much better indicator of 
ses if it were collected with parents' occupation or income band, there 
are various methodological difficulties with each of these so I don't 
think it is worthwhile collecting either.  They can be added later if 
highest qualification alone turns out to be too inaccurate for current 
purposes   

The data should be collected for all commencing domestic students, 
including postgraduates.  Increasingly students are pursing postgraduate 
qualifications to distinguish themselves from ordinary bachelors, and it 
would be useful to test whether this has an ses bias.  It is also 
important to test whether graduate entry occupational qualifications are 
even more biased by ses, which I suspect is the case. 

I support Griffith collecting data from 2009 and, incidentally, comparing 
this with postcode data. 

Gavin 


G.Moodie at griffith.edu.au
Vice Chancellor's office
GRIFFITH UNIVERSITY 4111, Australia
Home page: http://www.griffith.edu.au/vc/ate/moodie/
ph  +61 7 3735 5482
fax +61 7 3735 7507



Wendy Marchment/Staff/Griffith 
09/09/2008 02:56 PM 


To
Sue Spence/Staff/Griffith at Griffith, Joanna Peters/Staff/Griffith, Suzanne 
Wilkinson/Staff/Griffith, Gavin Moodie/Staff/Griffith, Cathy 
McGrath/Staff/Griffith at Griffith 
cc
Heather Cameron/Staff/Griffith at Griffith, John Fairbairn/Staff/Griffith 
Subject
New student data elements for low SES - feedback pls







Dear all, 

In the recent DEEWR September Newsletter available at 
http://www.heimshelp.deewr.gov.au/8_Newsletters/, a proposal is included 
re new student return data elements for identification on low SES, to 
replace the current postcode methodology. 

Would very much appreciate your feedback on the proposal by Monday 15th 
September COB in order to draft a response which is required by 19 
September. 

Feedback to include any/all of the following: 
1. appropriateness of questions framed 
2. which students should be asked eg all domestic undergraduates 
3. business process/system implications 
4. additional questions which may assist in more accurately reflecting low 
SES. 

For my part I think the proposed questions have the potential  to confuse 
most students and would be difficult to collect data-wise. Seems that 
DEEWR is endeavouring to cater for same sex couples with children. 

As we (ie Sue, John, Suzanne & I) were discussing this recently it seems 
timely, although from Griffith's point of view would prefer collection 
from 2009 internally. 

Please feel free to pass this on to any other staff member who may have a 
perspective on this. 


[attachment "Attachment 1.pdf" deleted by Gavin Moodie/Staff/Griffith] 
[attachment "Draft education_parent1 & 2 elements.pdf" deleted by Gavin 
Moodie/Staff/Griffith] 

Regards

Wendy Marchment
Director
Quality, Planning and Statistics 
Nathan campus, Griffith University 
Nathan  QLD  4111  Australia
www.griffith.edu.au/qps
Email: W.Marchment at griffith.edu.au
Telephone  (07) 373 54027 
Facsimile    (07) 373 55525 
************************************************************** 
PRIVATE AND CONFIDENTIAL 
This e-mail and any files transmitted with it are intended solely for the 
use of the addressee(s) and may contain information that is confidential 
or privileged. 
If you receive this e-mail and you are not the addressee, please disregard 
the contents of the e-mail, delete the e-mail, and notify the author 
immediately. 
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